Sunday, November 19, 2017

most reliable car models in the world

flyinggoatz: benz 190d never dies, its made for life time and audi 80/100 too

Saturday, November 18, 2017

it's going to take 5000 years to make a japanese car to beat a german car

Ronaldo Saad
41 minutes ago
david t Keep dreaming !!!! Its going to take 5000 years to make an japanese car to beat a german car in racings !!!! Forget it ! Never is going to happen

Thursday, November 16, 2017

carl zeiss is the only lens company that can make a wide angle lens

wkay • Senior Member • Posts: 1,058
Canon L wide angles are pathetic
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
Let's face it, Canon cant design a wide angle lens while Zeiss rules.. Zeiss needs to get that 21mm converted to Canon asap.
I agree, does the market need an $800 50mm? Or a $1400 85mm?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2417350?page=4

german camera leica is the best camera in the world

ChristiopherPerez • Regular Member • Posts: 176
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
Zeiss and Leica are in such a league of their own that any discriminating viewer of photographic art will know not only what camera and lens you took to make the photo, but that you are a very awesome photographer.
Yes. That's just the ticket. Isn't it? Er, maybe not.
The Zeiss lenses people are drooling over are made in Japan by Cosina, not in Germany by Zeiss.
Optical glass comes predominantly from China these days. Everyone uses it, even three letter agencies in the USofA. Optical glass from other countries is simply more expensive and are dying industries. China roars on, however, and this is where manufacturers have to go to get their materials.
The Zeiss designs you see for Canon, Nikon, and M42 Pentax all come from the time when Contax offered 35mm SLRs. They were/are good designs. But I have seen variability in implementation. From any manufacturer.
Its this variability in manufacturing that seems to get some of you guys all lathered up over which toy is better than another. Modern DSLR lenses are hideously complex. A few lenses make it to the street that should not have passed QA.
The manual focus Zeiss lenses are less complex. Yes, optics still need to be properly ground, centered, and assembled. Yes, Zeiss can specify the level of QA they want before Cosina can slap the word "Zeiss" on something. I'm sure its all in the contract.
From one perspective, its a matter of money. Have the money? Spend it. However, I doubt new Zeiss user's "art" will be any better than it already is today, pre-Zeiss and all that.
bgbs wrote:
exactly. zeiss and Leica lenses are in their own league. People may
argue which one is better Nikkor or Canon glass, but no one can argue
about zeiss.
-- hide signature --
Christopher Perez
  • See my portfolio In the RailYard published in LensWork Extended #78 Sept-Oct 2008
  • The sharpest lens in my kit is a tripod
  • Cameras have no talent. Its what's behind the eyepiece that counts.
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2417350?page=3

federer beat nadal in austrailian open 2017 with injury and hurt leg

Federer said: "I explained myself a couple of days ago after the Stan [Wawrinka semi-final] match. My leg has been hurting me since the [Noah] Rubin match [in the second round].

"I was happy that I was able to navigate through the pain. For some reason against Stan I had it from the start on both sides of the groin.

"After he took a medical timeout, I thought I could also take one for a change and see if actually something like a massage during the match is actually going to help me. It did a little bit potentially. I'm not sure.

"And then today after probably - well, I felt my quad midway through the second set already, and the groin started to hurt midway through the third set.

Monday, November 13, 2017

diesel BMW can get 51 MPG with good performance


Arnis Tarassu
3 years ago
I get 51MPG on my diesel BMW. Car is 13 (2001) years old. It is faster. It has more room. It is cheaper.
REPLY
1




Arnis Tarassu
Arnis Tarassu
2 years ago
+TheOneIMakeCommentsOn
1250km combined average, 1370km my personal best (60MPH mostly). Didn't expect that.
REPLY
1



vladabas
vladabas
1 year ago
+Arnis Tarassu To be honest i think you MPG numbers are incorrect, since BMW best MPG 2015 model 2015 BMW 328d  gets only 37 MPG combined. Also, it would be great if diesel vapors  were not highly carcinogenic.
Harmful emissions are far greater on diesel than on gasoline cars.
So to make things short, you are comparing apples and oranges...
REPLY
1



Arnis Tarassu
Arnis Tarassu
1 year ago
+vladabas I'm not sure about MPG conversation  but I can drive exactly 1250km (sometimes 1210, sometimes 1280) on 69 litres of fuel. I use GPS for distance measurement and receipt for paying for fuel is amount measurement. Using  google converter I get 51mpg. Also it is European vehicle, 4-cylinder diesel.
My vehicle does not make "diesel vapors". CO2, N2, H2O mainly. Also I don't start the engine cold in winter as vehicle is equipped with fuel preheater.

This MPG rating is exactly why Prius is not common in Europe.
Show less
REPLY



vladabas
vladabas
1 year ago
How is it possible to have a diesel car that is not producing diesel exhaust?!?!?!
International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) – part of the World Health Organisation – announced that it had reclassified diesel exhaust as a ‘definite carcinogen’ – putting it in its highest category (Category 1).
My Prius is currently at 48 MPG, so for that small amount of difference in fuel consumption i will gladly trade for a non carcinogenic petrol car.
Show less
REPLY



Arnis Tarassu
Arnis Tarassu
1 year ago
+vladabas There is no such thing as common " diesel exhaust". There are different chemicals that exit the tailpipe. And concentration of those depends on the vehicle. Don't believe everything. Euronorms show not a lot of difference between gasoline and diesel engines. Most notable difference is NOx limits. Still, this is not called "diesel exhaust" nor "diesel vapours". Gasoline vehicle exhaust is not air from Mount Everest also.
Anyway the main topic is that my old BMW uses about the same amount of fuel as hybrid drive.
Show less
REPLY



vladabas
vladabas
1 year ago
Can you please write exactly what type of BMW you drive?
REPLY



Arnis Tarassu
Arnis Tarassu
1 year ago
+vladabas E39 520d with M47 engine.
REPLY



vladabas
vladabas
1 year ago
Well according to official data your car can somewhat match Prius MPG only on highway.
In the city it should be around 35 MPG.
Is your fuel consumption mostly on highways?
REPLY



Arnis Tarassu
Arnis Tarassu
1 year ago
+vladabas I researched those mpg test procedures. City really means heavy traffic and a lot of stopgo situations. I have excellent right foot in city. I hardly ever use brake pedal. coast a lot. Also where I live our cities are rarely jammed. At night when traffic is very low and speed is around 25-35mph constantly efficiency is astronomical, 70 or more.unfortunately it is not sudtainable as there is always a reason to slow down. still for short trips I use Leaf and for hyperlong trips I use diesel. 50-60mpg is highway average on longer trips.
Show less
REPLY



vladabas
vladabas
1 year ago
Man you are starting to sound like a PR of BMW.
Your cars consumption as specified by BMW is 30 MPG in city and can only be compared to Prius in highway drive
Fuel Consumption - Economy - Combined:  5.9 L/100km
48 mpg UK / 40 mpg US
Fuel Consumption - Economy - City:  7.8 L/100km
36 mpg UK / 30 mpg US
read more at: http://www.ultimatespecs.com/car-specs/BMW/5072/BMW-E39-5-Series-520d.html
Those are specs by BMW, and now you are telling me that you are getting more than double MPG... Yeah, right!

Also "Euronorms show not a lot of difference between gasoline". Are you serious? All tests show huge difference between diesel and petrol engines. Remember VW scandal with diesel engines?  The programming caused the vehicles' nitrogen oxide (NOx) output to meet US standards during regulatory testing, but emit up to 40 times more NOx in real-world driving. 40 TIMES MORE during regular driving!
Obviously you know better than World Health Organisation that put diesel exhaust as a definite carcinogen. http://www.bbc.com/news/health-18415532
Seriously there is nothing else to discuss with you since your data does is far off from real world results.
Show less
REPLY
1



Arnis Tarassu
Arnis Tarassu
1 year ago
+vladabas Haha. Whatever. Fuel consumption is not a constant. And there is no such thing like "city" and "highway". Those are tests that are average. WHO might put it to cancirogenic or whatever list but people in EU have less cancer than in US, where Diesel vehicles are very very rare. Explain that. Also there is no such thing like diesel exhaust. There are chemicals that are exiting the exhaust. And VW scandal is a scandal. If you don't understand the problem in that then stop saying "40 times more NOx". There is much more NOx exiting your chimney than 100 diesel VW's.
Show less
REPLY

Kenneth
4 years ago
I can buy a used BMW M3 and I pay less in cash than the Prius.
REPLY

Saturday, November 11, 2017

peugeot is the most reliable car in the world

Peugeot used all over europe as taxis
and not uncommon to go 500-700k miles
will be needing a rebuild at that sort of age
oil changes here are at 10-15k miles fully synthetic

Wednesday, November 8, 2017

1999 Vw Passat 1.9tdi go 800 miles per tank

1999 Vw Passat 1.9tdi - $3500 


Up for sale is my 1999 Volkswagen Passat 1.9 turbo diesel, 5 speed manual transmission, 250 thousand on the body, 150 thousand on European spec 1.9 diesel engine/transmission. Head was replaced last year also replaced all 4 pistons rods, main/rod bearing(s), Valeo complete clutch kit single mass flywheel conversion unsprung stage 3 clutch, egr delete, 3' downpipe, 2.5 inch exhaust, 520 injectors, Ecu stage 3 tuned by Malone tuning, and much more. 40-50 miles per gallon on the highway, 800 miles per tank. 

Comes with a lot of extra parts, service manual, other good TDi reading, also have kept an extensive log of the car over the years. Well maintained and has had a lot of recent service performed. Such as valve cover gasket, rear main seal, fan clutch, axles, glow plugs/harness, a/c condenser, brakes all around, all fluids flushed and changed with oem spec Volkswagen recommended fluids. Will go over everything in detail with serious buyers.

Car runs and drives without issue, if you're looking for a reliable commuter/daily driver that gets 40-50 mpg, cheap insurance, and puts a smile on your face look no further. $3,500 firm!! Please no low ballers, I have a lot of time, effort, and of course $$$ in oem parts in the car. Hate to see it go but I have other vehicles that need attention.

Thanks for looking!

Tuesday, November 7, 2017

making lens involves craftsmanship

NAB 2013: Carl Zeiss – A Tradition of Innovation & Craftsmanship
by Clint Milby May 30, 2013 0 Comments Events, NAB, News


If lenses were cars, then Carl Zeiss would be Mercedes-Benz.  I say this not only because both are German manufacturers who started out in the late 1800s, but because both companies have long tradition of excellence rooted in innovation and craftsmanship.  Just as Mercedes-Benz is responsible for developing the first internal combustion automobile engine and the float carburetor Zeiss is responsible for developing the lens manufacturing process from guess work to a carefully formulated science.


Zeiss10
As a filmmaker, this is important to keep in mind when you consider what lenses to purchase.  True, you may save money in the short run by buying from companies that have taken Zeiss’s 150+ years of experience for their own products, but if you ever get a chance to work with any of the Zeiss lenses for either stills or cinema, you’ll see very clearly what you’ve lost in return. Because Zeiss invented many of the lenses we still use in modern production, the company as a whole has a deeper understanding of why a lens system works, and that understanding empowers them to build a better product. Couple that with their relentless pursuit of the best materials and extremely high standards for craftsmanship then it’s apparent why so many shooters and camera manufacturers turn to Carl Zeiss for their lenses.


Zeiss02
In this, the second part of my three part interview with Carl Zeiss’s own Rich Schleuning, Rich discusses the history of Zeiss starting in the 1840’s. At that time, the company’s namesake, Carl Zeiss, was manufacturing microscopes, then to still lens production and finally to cinema lenses in the 1930s. As Schleuning breaks down the lineage of the Zeiss line of products, it becomes clear why companies like Arri, Sony, Hasselblad and others trust their cameras to Zeiss. Finally, Schleuning takes us through the development of the their now famous Compact Primes to further empower not just camera manufacturers but shooters and cinematographers to capture their vision with Zeiss unmatched clarity and craftsmanship.



To find out more about the Zeiss Compact Primes and Zooms and all of the other great products from Carl Zeiss, go to their website at For more information on the Zeiss CZ 28-80 and all of the other great lenses from Zeiss, go to their website at lenses.zeiss.com

Seeing is believing, so if you’re going to be in the Los Angeles area 5/31/13 – 6/1/13, check out the Zeiss Compact Primes and Compact Zooms at their booth 49.


http://indieshooter.com/nab-2013-carl-zeiss-part-ii-history-craftsmanship-and-warranty/

my italian cars(fiat, maserati) never had any problems


Charles Lowe · 

I have a Fiat 500 Abarth,Maserati,Gran Turismo and a Range Rover Sports,and never ever any problems what so ever.
LikeReply1Oct 26, 2017 12:39am


Monday, November 6, 2017

Is Toyota ever going to admit that the the 2.4L, 2AZFE engine have a production defect in the 2002-2006 Camry, the 2001-07 Highlander, 2004-05 RAV4 and the 2002-06 Solara models?


maddognv

 Sparks,Nv October 31, 2012

Is Toyota ever going to admit that the the 2.4L, 2AZFE engine have a production defect in the 2002-2006 Camry, the 2001-07 Highlander, 2004-05 RAV4 and the 2002-06 Solara models? I,m referring to the stripped threads in the engine block. Probably not. Don.t need any more bad PR. This something NHTSA has know about since 2006. Guess they don't consider it a safety hazard when the head gasket blows going done the highway at 65. How can they rate a cars reliability after only 12 months?
https://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/30/why-consumer-reports-and-j-d-power-are-so-different/

Sunday, November 5, 2017

칼자이스 렌즈가 세계최고의 이유


오늘은 세계 최고의 렌즈 칼자이스 렌즈를 소개해드리겠습니다.
카메라 렌즈, 현미경, 인공위성 등등
정밀함을 필요한 최첨단 기기는 대부분 칼자이스 렌즈를 사용하고있습니다.
그만큼 기술력이 뛰어나기 때문이죠.
당연히 안경렌즈 부분에서도 최고의 기술력을 자랑하고있습니다.

? 
 
?

칼자이스 렌즈가 최고인 이유 첫 번째
프리미엄 코팅인 듀라비전플래티넘(DP)코팅입니다.
기본 대비 3배 강하며 유리코팅 대비 35% 강합니다.
내마모성, 정전기 감소, 쉬운 세척은 기본이며
무엇보다 일반적인 그린 코팅 대비 20%적은 반사인 블루 코팅입니다.
(청광 차단때문에 블루 코팅이 아닙니다.)


 


두번째 이유는 드라이브세이프!!!
동공 크기를 고려한 루미넌스 디자인
듀라비전 드라이브 세이프 코팅
라식/라섹 후 빛 번짐 때문에 고생하시는 분들이나...
야간 운전을 많이 하시는 분들께 특히 좋은 렌즈입니다.
이 기술력은 현재 칼자이스밖에 아직 없습니다.

?
 


세 번째
근시 진행 완화 렌즈인 마이오비전입니다.
모든 렌즈 회사에 누진 디자인의 조절력 완화 기술력은 있지만.
오로지 마이오비전만이 주변시 관리 기술로 근시 진행을 완화시키는 효과를 지니고 있습니다.


네번째
칼자이스 렌즈만 보유한 특허!
포토퓨전입니다.
타회사 변색렌즈보다 변색 속도가 빠르며 색상이 균일합니다.

?

마지막으로
망막질환의 증상을 완하시켜주는 메디컬렌즈입니다.
칼자이스만의 기술력이 빛나는 렌즈입니다.
더 많은 장점이 있지만~!
오늘은 다섯가지만 자랑하는걸로^^


렌즈회사 중 유일하게
칼자이스렌즈는 품질보증서 및 자세값을 보정한 도수 처방전이 나옵니다.
역시...최고죠?







carl zeiss lens is the best lens by far


Matt@Vancouver 6년 전에
I want my lens to be sharp, of which I've never been disappointed with Zeiss; but more importantly for me, is tonal quality. The characteristics of how a lens renders a scene with colours and contrast.
To my eyes, Canon L lenses render images in a way that's flashy, tacky, and immature. Whereas Zeiss lenses tend to have qualities that are a bit more cinematic, classy, and mature... very easy to process these photos into something more timeless instead of something that's flashy, exciting, and easily discardable.

I've owned the best L lenses, including the 85mm F1.2 mkII,
Even when I had that lens, I would use 50MM ZE F1.4 (the cheapest Zeiss lens) more... Canon lenses just don't have "character".

Also there's the durability factor, and I don't just mean how the parts are all metal constructed. There are too many mechanical parts in Canon lenses, those things are bound to wear out in time. Even if you had the money to fix it it's unlikely Canon will have parts for those lenses. The 85L has a focusing override mechanism so that when the AF goes one day you can't even manual focus. And electronic based moving parts all have life lines.


Charlie Packard PRO 6년 전에
I am one of those strange people who prefers manual focus !
Compared to modern Nikon glass, the longer focusing throw of the ZF lenses gives me the accurate control that I want.
Their quality is unquestionable and the colour rendition a delight.


Manuel Ferreira Chaves 6년 전에
Zeiss lenses in my glasses were the best ever. I owned a Praktika B1 with 2 Zeiss zoom lenses back when I was still a teen - and positively loved that camera, which was unfortunately stolen from my car in 1989.


MikeCD2011 5년 전에
I have used Zeiss optics for all of my photographic career... not exclusively, I used whatever was available at the various studios and agencies I worked with... but, when I can choose, or have to lay down my own money... then it is Zeiss. I believe that many things make Zeiss the right choice for me... I do not often shoot sport or wildlife so auto-focus is not needed as far as I am concerned... Clarity, Colour, sharpness are all second to none.... the bokeh is beautiful... but for me, the best about Zeiss is the way it draws the image... with all of the above mentioned qualities producing images that are what I see and want to capture for others to see....

Here are a couple of images from a recent shoot at a museum north of Copenhagen that really convey what I see as Zeiss qualities...

Door, table and light...


Work at the stove

Pantry


I am looking forward to continued Zeiss innovation and quality, thanks...

Blunder 5년 전에
I wanted a 35mm for my 5DIII.
The Zeiss 1.4 is the best.
Nuf said.


Mozaa01 5년 전에
because they are the best available for my sony system and having never had a lens of this quality before on my previous canon system and at this time of my life having the money to spend on them I am absolutely blown away at the quality of the glass on them, i have a 24-70, 85mm and having a hard time deciding on a 16-35 or 135mm as my next solution.


`/1nc3nt 5년 전에을(를) 게시하였습니다. 편집자: `/1nc3nt (member) 5년 전에
If you shot slides before, you will understand.

It gives you pleasant color tonal range and most of all, fine detail on rendering. Bokeh is not my first priority, bad bokeh with perfect subject is still a good image. My intention on using them is also for experimenting on movies.

Owned 85/1.4 and 21/2.8. Trying to get 15, 35/1.4 and 100/2. Personally the others are not compelling to me. Those 5 lenses are their best.

Comparing against other brands. Nikon and Mamiya (Sorry, I never use Canon) are also best manufacturers for lenses for mortals. Zeiss is simply beyond spectacular.


yangster007 5년 전에
Really love the Zeiss 100mm f/2 Markro Planar, it's THE BEST macro lens I've ever used, even beating the Canon 100mm f/2.8 L. The color and sharpness just look so beautiful.


Carol How Photography 4년 전에을(를) 게시하였습니다. 편집자: Carol How Photography (member) 4년 전에
I bought my first Zeiss, the 50 Planar ZF2 1/4 because I wanted the best. Some people poo pooed the 50 - I simply proved them all wrong. The 50 is stellar at night and medium distance. It was a good thing for my personal photography to work with one focal length only. I did that for a whole YEAR. I now have 3 other Zeiss lenses, 35 1.4; 85 1.4 and 100 Macro Planar 2. I use them almost exclusively.
Which is my favourite Zeiss lens? The Zeiss that is on my camera at the time…I cannot choose because I adore each of them. Yes, for me it is a love affair… the 3D quality, the colour, the feeling of pride you have when the stars align.
Weathering the storms


maideen 3년 전에
The only reason I bought the Sony Nex because it can interface with cal zeiss lens.
That is the best lens.


schullerjohannes 2년 전에
Because the 135mm 1.8 CZ is one of the best lenses out there. We do the most of our portraits with this lens. The sharpness wide open is like a razor.

www.flickr.com/photos/johanneschuller/23672815796/

or

www.flickr.com/photos/johanneschuller/23338316679/

https://www.flickr.com/groups/1458294@N20/discuss/72157628515161559/


carl zeiss lens is the best in the world by far



Ken Paul
Ken Paul, Professional Photographer Travel, Food, Places (1985-present)
Answered Oct 28
Zeiss began in other high tolerance optic applications prior to expanding into photo optics. That experience & research Producing high contrast low aberration at wide open, fixed aperature mounts for microscopes carried over to camera applications.
In film cameras the difference between a Nikkor & Zeiss was pronounced due to the higher contrast of the Zeiss. Leitz optics for Leica followed a similar genesis & they too had superior contrast. Better contrast produces higher resolution to film halides & would produce a sharper image.
Today in most images, that superiority is mitigated by digital sensors & software to shape the final images. So the added quality is really not realized & in no way will amateurs or probably anyone argue that the difference in quality vs cost of a full frame Canon & a manual full frame Zeiss in the same speed & focal length. The best value in Zeiss is to explore higher end point & shoots that have a fast Zeiss lens.
That being said, I truly miss working in Hasselblad with my posse of Zeiss optics that were just magnificent pieces of optical art & science...
47 Views
UpvoteDownvote
Share

RecommendedAll
Poto Popo

William Smith
William Smith, Advanced amateur photographer--analog and digital
Answered Oct 24
Zeiss, in my opinion, makes the best lenses in the world. (I know, I know, a Leica enthusiast will say otherwise.) I’ve used them on several generations of Contax cameras, on Rollies, and on Hasselblads. The sharpness, the color, the feel, as well as the build quality—all are first rate. I am very fond of my Nikon lenses (and Fuji lenses as well), but if I could, I’d certainly add Zeiss lenses in Nikon fit to my kit. I’m planning to get a Canon digital solely because I can use an adapter to use my manual focus Contax C/Y lenses on it.
Worth the money, and there’s nothing wrong with manual focus, particularly if you are shooting buildings, landscapes, and portraits. It makes you more in control of the work.
93 Views
UpvoteDownvote
Share

carl zeiss lens is the best lens

Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
Started Sep 15, 2008 | Discussions
Forum
‹ Previous
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
Next ›
Threaded view
JackM
JackM • Veteran Member • Posts: 7,953
Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
Sep 15, 2008
Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book, but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something otherwise they would not jump in this market.
 JackM's gear list:
 Canon EOS 7D Mark II   Canon EOS 5DS R   Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II USM  Canon EF 100mm f/2.0 USM   Canon EF 16-35mm F4L IS USM  +5 more
Reply to thread    Reply with quote    Complain
George Kalemanis • Forum Member • Posts: 91
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something
otherwise they would not jump in this market.
I've used Zeiss for MF gear and played with Sony's 135/1.8, and 'L' lenses don't compare. Zeiss is sharp edge to edge, colors are bold yet neutral, and contrast is outstanding. I'm actually not all that impressed with Canon's 'L' quality, maybe it's because I'm used to using Zeiss.
 George Kalemanis's gear list:
 Canon EOS 5D Mark II   Carl Zeiss Distagon T* 2,8/21  Carl Zeiss Makro-Planar T* 2/100   Carl Zeiss Distagon T* 2/35  Carl Zeiss Planar T* 1,4/50  +2 more
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
hunk
hunk • Veteran Member • Posts: 3,227
There is no such thing as L-quality
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
Although they are branded, priced and colored simular there is no way you can compare a 85L with a 16-35L...

Maybe lenses like the 85L should be renamed 85XL

JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something
otherwise they would not jump in this market.
-- hide signature --
wild images and such at my website
http://www.x32.nl
 hunk's gear list:
 Leica M9   Canon Extender EF 2x II   Sony 135mm F2.8 (T4.5) STF
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
JackM
OP JackM • Veteran Member • Posts: 7,953
Re: There is no such thing as L-quality
In reply to hunk • Sep 15, 2008
hunk wrote:

Although they are branded, priced and colored simular there is no way
you can compare a 85L with a 16-35L...

Maybe lenses like the 85L should be renamed 85XL
Can you clarify this? Are you saying the 85L is so much better than the 16-35L that they should be classified differently?

And what does this have to do with Zeiss?
 JackM's gear list:
 Canon EOS 7D Mark II   Canon EOS 5DS R   Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II USM  Canon EF 100mm f/2.0 USM   Canon EF 16-35mm F4L IS USM  +5 more
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Lundy • Contributing Member • Posts: 795
Zeiss has been around for a long time
In reply to George Kalemanis • Sep 15, 2008
For those folks that are new to photography and never shot film. Do some zeiss research.

Here is a start.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Zeiss_AG

Carl Zeiss is one of the oldest existing optics manufacturers in the world.

The ZM line from Zeiss was on the Leica M series when some of the worlds most famous images were taken.
--
Lundy

'Sometimes the best part of wanting something is not having it.' ME 1994

http://www.pbase.com/lundy
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Garrett Lucas • Contributing Member • Posts: 515
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
I've got several L lenses that I'm extremely satisfied with including the 200mm F2.8, the 135mm F2, and the 300mm F4. In fact, my next purchase will be the 500mm F4. Couple that with the 15MP 1.6x crop 50D, and I think you'll have a fantastic wildlife package with an effective 800F4 and plenty of room to crop.

But! What Zeiss brings to the picture that Canon has had problem with (for years and plenty enough time to correct I might add) is fantastic quality in the Wide Angle area. I've used Zeiss lenses on both a Hasselblad and a Contax RX and G2, and their wide angle lenses are superb. If the 5D MKII can produce images similar to the current 50D examples but with more MP's, then I think you would have a terrific landscape combo if you used the 5D MKII with a 21mm Zeiss lens. I'm just drooling at the thought!
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Edward Karaa • Senior Member • Posts: 1,272
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
Some are much better than their L equivalents, some are quite equal or slightly inferior. That is in terms of sharpness only.

Zeiss lenses give you the very distinctive Zeiss look, something that L lenses will never give you, even when they are sharper.

High micro-contrast, amazing bokeh, saturated neutral colors, and of course that intangible 3D effect.

Once you use Zeiss, there is no way back.

JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something
otherwise they would not jump in this market.
 Edward Karaa's gear list:
 Leica M9   Sony Alpha 7   Leica M Typ 240   Carl Zeiss Biogon T* 2,8/25 ZM  Carl Zeiss Biogon T* 2/35 ZM  +4 more
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Anastigmat • Forum Pro • Posts: 12,663
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something
otherwise they would not jump in this market.
Carl Zeiss brings the famous T* lens coating, one of the best in the world. BTW, what does Canon call its lens coating?

Carl Zeiss of course also brings a lot of expertise and experience in lens designs. Carl Zeiss also brings with it Schott AG glass, a world renowned and highly respected maker of lens elements. Carl Zeiss has an extensive lineup of fast and wide prime lenses.

That said, Canon has the edge over Carl Zeiss in telephoto lenses. Canon is alone in the world in its expertise on manufacturing fluorite elements, which are found in the white L lenses that many pros use. Carl Zeiss, OTOH, use mirror lens designs for its 500 and 1000mm telephotos.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
submagination • Senior Member • Posts: 1,078
Not if you want to autofocus
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
People put different value on different features - and for some, AF is an important feature.

-- hide signature --
Website: http://mikebrum.com/
Photoblog: http://submagination.com/
Filckr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikebrum/
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Anastigmat • Forum Pro • Posts: 12,663
Re: There is no such thing as L-quality
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
JackM wrote:

hunk wrote:

Although they are branded, priced and colored simular there is no way
you can compare a 85L with a 16-35L...

Maybe lenses like the 85L should be renamed 85XL
Can you clarify this? Are you saying the 85L is so much better than
the 16-35L that they should be classified differently?

And what does this have to do with Zeiss?
Canon is much better at designing telephotos than wide angles. The telephoto L lenses are unequaled by Nikon or Carl Zeiss or just about anybody else because Canon has mastered the production of fluorite elements. The other camera makers use ED glass instead of fluorite crystal. So, a Carl Zeiss wide angle lens may be better than a wide angle L lens or wide angle L zoom, but Carl Zeiss has nothing to compete with, say, the 500mm L, 600mm L or 800mm L. Carl Zeiss does have some wonderful mirror lenses but they have all the disadvantages of mirror lenses including awful bokeh and lack of autofocus.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
auksnapper • Contributing Member • Posts: 781
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
Zeiss are very good at making w/a lenses which Canon isn't. Perhaps the soon to be announced fast L w/a's will change that but I doubt it.

I have a feeling that the 21mm f2.8 be the top selling ZE when it goes on sale next year
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
hunk
hunk • Veteran Member • Posts: 3,227
Re: There is no such thing as L-quality
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
JackM wrote:

hunk wrote:

Although they are branded, priced and colored simular there is no way
you can compare a 85L with a 16-35L...

Maybe lenses like the 85L should be renamed 85XL
Can you clarify this? Are you saying the 85L is so much better than
the 16-35L that they should be classified differently?
And what does this have to do with Zeiss?
yes, exactly... I own the 16-35 mkI and mkII but to be honest I'm a bit dissapointed in them after I worked with offerings from other companies. The 85L is one of Canon's gems.
 hunk's gear list:
 Leica M9   Canon Extender EF 2x II   Sony 135mm F2.8 (T4.5) STF
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
glacierpete • Senior Member • Posts: 1,917
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
There is a lot of information in the Nikon SLR lens talk section about Zeiss ZF lenses for Nikon mount. I assume they will bring out the same lens line for Canon mount over time.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
JackM
OP JackM • Veteran Member • Posts: 7,953
Hmm, interesting.
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
Now that I read more, these Zeiss lenses actually fill a couple gaps in the Canon lineup. There is a huge price chasm between the 50/1.4 and the 50/1.2L, likewise between the 85/1.8 and 85/1.2L. The Zeiss lenses will fit nicely in there. I'd like to try one!

Canon 85/1.8: $355, 9 elements
Zeiss 85/1.4: $1170, 6 elements
Canon 85/1.2L: $1870, 8 elements

Canon 50/1.4: $325, 7 elements
Zeiss 50/1.4: $660, 7 elements
Canon 50/1.2L: $1400, 8 elements
 JackM's gear list:
 Canon EOS 7D Mark II   Canon EOS 5DS R   Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II USM  Canon EF 100mm f/2.0 USM   Canon EF 16-35mm F4L IS USM  +5 more
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Aurance • Contributing Member • Posts: 848
Robert White supplies Nikon/Zeiss Combos!
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
Robert White - the Lecia and Zeiss Lens supplier has been selling Nikon DSLRs + Zeiss Lens combos for some time!

Now that Zeiss has announced a 'proper' Canon mount for their lenses (not an adaptor) I suspect Zeiss will increase their business (a shrewd move for Zeiss).

I suspect that when the Canon 5D MKII appears, Robert White will be selling that with Zeiss Lenses as well.

The 'Zeiss 3D Effect' on the image is what prompts the attention to Zeiss but in relation to overall quality it is a 'close run' thing between Canon L Lenses and Zeiss. Certainly Zeiss is a considered choice for 'prime wide angle'.

Useful Links:-

http://www.robertwhite.co.uk/

http://diglloyd.com/diglloyd/infos/ZeissZFLenses/index.html
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
CANONNIKONSONY • Forum Member • Posts: 50
Re: There is no such thing as L-quality
In reply to hunk • Sep 15, 2008
Nothing touches the 85mm L 1.2 II. I have shot film and digital for years (Nikon, Leica etc). Unless you actually shoot with this lens it is hard to explain. Now Canon L wide angle zooms are not the greatest or the worst.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
michaelbs • Senior Member • Posts: 2,687
135L on par with 85L II
In reply to hunk • Sep 15, 2008
hunk wrote:

yes, exactly... I own the 16-35 mkI and mkII but to be honest I'm a
bit dissapointed in them after I worked with offerings from other
companies. The 85L is one of Canon's gems.
Why does everybody rave about 85L and no one mentions 135L ?
It's just as good. Sharp wide open and wonderful creamy bokeh. Just like the 85L

-- hide signature --
best regards
Michael

http://michaelbennati.dk/?Det_Kongelige_Teater:Koret
http://flickr.com/photos/23466858@N02/
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
michaelbs • Senior Member • Posts: 2,687
Huh? Canon can't do WA? What about 35L??!!
In reply to Anastigmat • Sep 15, 2008
Anastigmat wrote:

JackM wrote:

Canon is much better at designing telephotos than wide angles. The
telephoto L lenses are unequaled by Nikon or Carl Zeiss or just about
anybody else because Canon has mastered the production of fluorite
elements. The other camera makers use ED glass instead of fluorite
crystal. So, a Carl Zeiss wide angle lens may be better than a wide
angle L lens or wide angle L zoom, but Carl Zeiss has nothing to
compete with, say, the 500mm L, 600mm L or 800mm L. Carl Zeiss does
have some wonderful mirror lenses but they have all the disadvantages
of mirror lenses including awful bokeh and lack of autofocus.
To me 35L is a stellar lens. Canon must do something right when they can make a lens like that. Super sharp at f1.4, great bokeh, colour, contrast. I love that lens.
--
best regards
Michael

http://michaelbennati.dk/?Det_Kongelige_Teater:Koret
http://flickr.com/photos/23466858@N02/
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
CANONNIKONSONY • Forum Member • Posts: 50
Re: 135L on par with 85L II
In reply to michaelbs • Sep 15, 2008
-- hide signature --
I think the 85L is just a more wanted distance for portrait studio work. 135mm used to be the standard for portrait work. My clients almost always like the look from the 85 over a focal distance of 135mm. Do get me wrong the 135 is great.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
rrcphoto • Veteran Member • Posts: 6,173
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something
otherwise they would not jump in this market.
depends what you call better - each has their usefullness.

canon L offer (outside of the 85L) extremely fast and accurate AF - that you won't get with Zeiss.

Zeiss lenses of this grade are built really for the manual focus - the damping and finite control you have over the manual focus is well, dreamy .. it's smooth, controlled and "feels" perfect.

optically - at their sweet spot, you will have less QA related issues - simply because their tolerances are higher, the cost is higher for each lens, and they don't pump out as many per year.

coating wise - Zeiss gives a more contrasty look than out of the box L's .. T coatings seem to deliver more "depth" - this style has been debated since the beginning of time it seems against the leica and zeiss folks - leica giving a more natural flavour, and zeiss more punchier.

sharper, etc really depends on the lens - the 21mm is legendary, however, the 50, 85 while excellent - are close to, or equalled by canon counterparts - especially when stopped down at their sweet spot - contrary to popular belief - zeiss lenses don't break the laws of optics and are not sharp all the way through their aperatures - but when stopped down, they are as good as it gets - just as some canon L's are. some of the differences can be because of the coatings mentioned about .. T making the image feel contraster than SSC coatings.

it should also be mentioned that this line is not weathersealed as well - so if that's an issue with you, you're better off sticking with Canon L .. which are for the most part, weathersealed.

outside of macro and landscape I wouldn't really consider using zeiss ZE lenses - but in those two environments, I find the MF necessity of the lenses actually helps me as a photographer to slow down, consider, and compose, versus AF lock and shoot.
Reply    Reply with quote 

HeyItsJoel • Contributing Member • Posts: 972
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to Anastigmat • Sep 15, 2008
Canon is alone in the world in its expertise on manufacturing
fluorite elements, which are found in the white L lenses that many
pros use.
Are you saying that Nikon's "non-L" telephoto lenses are inferior to that of Canon's L's? That's a pretty bold statement considering that many Nikon's were found in the hands of the press during the recent Olympic games.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
CKDexterHaven • Regular Member • Posts: 221
No.
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
I have a good amount of experience with Zeiss. With Hasselblad, Rolleiflex, Contax G2, RX, Aria, N1, T2, and T3.

With those cameras, i've happily used a few of the best lenses made. I really liked the AF-85/1.4 Planar with my N1. But, i wouldn't trade a Zeiss 85/1.4 for my 85L.

From what i've seen from the manual focus 50/1.4 Planar in Nikon mount, i have no interest in the ZE 50/1.4. It may be sharp, but the bokeh is horrid. I'll keep my good sample of the Canon 50/1.4 and possibly add a Sigma 50/1.4. This is a shame, because the Contax/Zeiss 50/1.4 is fantastic. The Contax 45/2 Planar was fantastic. I had an N-50/1.4 with AF. Loved it. I don't know how the Planar formula or construction changed with these Zx lenses, but out of focus rendition is worse than current Nikkor 50s.

Zeiss will eventually make a 35/2 and 28/2 in ZE mount. But, i think i'll keep my 35L. I can't imagine a better lens, and certainly not a better one without AF.

Yes, Canon has a poor reputation with wide angles. But, i would not be enthusiastic about manually focusing wide angle lenses on a dSLR. Even with the EE-S screen on my 5D, it's not like shooting with an EOS 3.... I suppose if i were a landscape shooter, i would be happy with a Zeiss wide, and AF confirmation. But, i shoot people, primarily, and i want either a true manual focus camera, or AF on a dSLR.

Zeiss lenses are wonderful, as a group. But, just because it says Zeiss on it doesn't make it automatically better than its counterpart from another manufacturer. Some Zeiss lenses make sense. Some don't. It depends on what and how you shoot and what's available from Canon.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
SageTCR • Regular Member • Posts: 421
Sample links?
In reply to CKDexterHaven • Sep 15, 2008
Hi guys!
I have to admit that i havent been looking at images takes with Zeiss lenes ^^

Anyone got links to images taken with these great lenses?... looking forward to see how much better these are compared to Canon´s L.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
dotborg • Veteran Member • Posts: 8,251
The two lenses they announced...
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
...are not better than the Canon L versions. However, the 21mm f/2.8 Distagon is better than anything Canon has at this point.

-- hide signature --
Whoever said 'a picture is worth a thousand words' was a cheapskate.

http://www.pbase.com/dot_borg
http://www.modelmayhem.com/dotborg
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
SageTCR • Regular Member • Posts: 421
Re: The two lenses they announced...
In reply to dotborg • Sep 15, 2008
Thats what i suspected.. so why would anyone buy lenses to the same price as L´s with equal preformance and no AF? Cos of the name or is there more to this?
Sorry.. im a noob
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
auksnapper • Contributing Member • Posts: 781
Re: The two lenses they announced...
In reply to dotborg • Sep 15, 2008
dotborg wrote:

...are not better than the Canon L versions. However, the 21mm f/2.8
Distagon is better than anything Canon has at this point.

-- hide signature --
Whoever said 'a picture is worth a thousand words' was a cheapskate.

http://www.pbase.com/dot_borg
http://www.modelmayhem.com/dotborg
Sorry I have to disagree with you, see the reviews below

http://www.photozone.de/canon-eos/159-canon-ef-50mm-f14-usm-test-report--review?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/nikon--nikkor-aps-c-lens-tests/255-zeiss-planar-zf-t-50mm-f14-review--lab-test-report?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/canon-eos/163-canon-ef-85mm-f12-usm-l-test-report--review?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/nikon--nikkor-aps-c-lens-tests/256-zeiss-planar-zf-t-85mm-f14-review--test-report?start=1
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
bgbs • Veteran Member • Posts: 3,195
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to Edward Karaa • Sep 15, 2008
exactly. zeiss and Leica lenses are in their own league. People may argue which one is better Nikkor or Canon glass, but no one can argue about zeiss.
--
Ben
Design is all I do.
bibikova.com
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
George Kalemanis • Forum Member • Posts: 91
Re: The two lenses they announced...
In reply to auksnapper • Sep 15, 2008
auksnapper wrote:

dotborg wrote:

...are not better than the Canon L versions. However, the 21mm f/2.8
Distagon is better than anything Canon has at this point.

-- hide signature --
Whoever said 'a picture is worth a thousand words' was a cheapskate.

http://www.pbase.com/dot_borg
http://www.modelmayhem.com/dotborg
Sorry I have to disagree with you, see the reviews below

http://www.photozone.de/canon-eos/159-canon-ef-50mm-f14-usm-test-report--review?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/nikon--nikkor-aps-c-lens-tests/255-zeiss-planar-zf-t-50mm-f14-review--lab-test-report?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/canon-eos/163-canon-ef-85mm-f12-usm-l-test-report--review?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/nikon--nikkor-aps-c-lens-tests/256-zeiss-planar-zf-t-85mm-f14-review--test-report?start=1
You proved this point well. Look at the Canon's lenses, they lack edge sharpness and uniformity Canon needs to become serious about lens making, and not just trying to produce lenses that are "good enough". For the money they are charging for some of "L" glass, they need to shoot a little higher.
 George Kalemanis's gear list:
 Canon EOS 5D Mark II   Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM  Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM   Carl Zeiss Distagon T* 2,8/21  Carl Zeiss Distagon T* 2/35  +2 more
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
andypoo • Regular Member • Posts: 105
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to George Kalemanis • Sep 15, 2008
George Kalemanis wrote:

JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something
otherwise they would not jump in this market.
I've used Zeiss for MF gear and played with Sony's 135/1.8, and 'L'
lenses don't compare. Zeiss is sharp edge to edge, colors are bold
yet neutral, and contrast is outstanding. I'm actually not all that
impressed with Canon's 'L' quality, maybe it's because I'm used to
using Zeiss.
Agreed

I've played with the 138/1.8 too, and the colours and contrast at wide open is stunning. Makes me want to swich to sony...

The 135/2L lags behind by a bit...=(
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
CKDexterHaven • Regular Member • Posts: 221
Re: Sample links?
In reply to SageTCR • Sep 15, 2008
Go to Flickr or photosig and search for whichever lens you'd like.

But, then, factor in postprocessing, film/sensor/camera, the photographer's skill, lighting conditions, exposure accuracy, JPG compression... and online samples will be pretty much moot.

Forget about judging sharpness and color online. About the only thing you can get a true sense of is bokeh.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
OliverCardona • Regular Member • Posts: 316
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.
Ouuuch! You better delete that.... it is actually the other way round - Sony gets a couple of notches up with Zeiss lenses.

Zeiss is the ultimate glass my friend.
--
f/8

http://www.olivercardona.com
(site in progress)
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
MaxFX • Contributing Member • Posts: 561
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
No matter what; Zeiss lenses are great additions for Canon users. I would never buy a Tamron or Sigma but I would buy Zeiss...

New lenses are just beginning, Zeiss lens lineup for Canon mount will increase dramatically in a few years...

-- hide signature --
MaxFX
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Richard Dong • Contributing Member • Posts: 923
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to HeyItsJoel • Sep 15, 2008
Fluorite is a magical substance that endows lenses with overhwhelming powers of resolution. (:-0

-- hide signature --
Richard D.
http://www.photocritique.net/cgi-bin/phtg?xx+RICHARD+DONG
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Mark K
Mark K • Veteran Member • Posts: 5,605
Re: Is Zeiss better than Canon L?
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
The only lens I have from Zeiss is 16-80, an expensive kit lens. Well after months of using, I was speechless for its sharpness at aperture wide open.

Personally I love L lenses' colour and build. It will be interesting to have all these Zeiss lenses to compare my L lenses

JackM wrote:

Yeah, I have no experience with Zeiss lenses. I have to admit their
association with Sony kind of knocks them down a notch in my book,
but that is purely irrational on my part.

What can Zeiss bring to the table that Canon can't? Surely something
otherwise they would not jump in this market.
-- hide signature --
Mark K
http://www.pbase.com/herbridgemo
 Mark K's gear list:
 Sony RX100 III   Sony SLT-A77   Nikon D800   Canon EOS 5D Mark III   NEX5R  +67 more
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
pdw • Contributing Member • Posts: 689
bull feces
In reply to Anastigmat • Sep 15, 2008
The latest Nikon teles are every bit as good, if not better than, the Canon equivelents. Also, Canon has nothing that equals the 200-400/4.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
rrcphoto • Veteran Member • Posts: 6,173
Re: The two lenses they announced...
In reply to auksnapper • Sep 15, 2008
auksnapper wrote:

dotborg wrote:

...are not better than the Canon L versions. However, the 21mm f/2.8
Distagon is better than anything Canon has at this point.

-- hide signature --
Whoever said 'a picture is worth a thousand words' was a cheapskate.

http://www.pbase.com/dot_borg
http://www.modelmayhem.com/dotborg
Sorry I have to disagree with you, see the reviews below

http://www.photozone.de/canon-eos/159-canon-ef-50mm-f14-usm-test-report--review?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/nikon--nikkor-aps-c-lens-tests/255-zeiss-planar-zf-t-50mm-f14-review--lab-test-report?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/canon-eos/163-canon-ef-85mm-f12-usm-l-test-report--review?start=1

http://www.photozone.de/nikon--nikkor-aps-c-lens-tests/256-zeiss-planar-zf-t-85mm-f14-review--test-report?start=1
mmm did you read the disclaimer about comparing across camera systems?

you really can't look at those results as a basis of comparison, because AA filter and how they did the analysis is really camera body specific - and definately brand specific.

also the 50/1.4 ZF suffers from oddly high CA throughout it's aperature range - which is not exactly something I'd expect from Zeiss.

both lenses from either canon or zeiss do not have impeccible corner performance wide open - that's a myth.

however, every one of those lenses when sweet spotted will produce great results. my zeisses, I never use wide open. corner performance on FF .. is rather MEH! .. however, stopped down, using their sweet spot? wonderful .. but that's really the same for any canon lens I have too.

canon L's will require more PP to get a T "look" to the images but after that's done, there's really hardly any difference in between them..

now the 28,25, 21mm zeiss's .. against the non L variants - no competition! .. Against the 24/1.4 gives the 24mm and the 21mm a run for their money - but the 24L can't match the resolving power of the zeiss - but the zeiss also suffers from a gull waveform distortion which is harder to correct in post processing - thus if you need to correct for distortion, you end up losing some of that resolving power that you initially had, and that 24/1.4 will throw out DOF wide open and get shots wide open that the zeiss could only dream about.
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
photoshrink • Regular Member • Posts: 280
Just a note to thank all of you above for your comments
In reply to rrcphoto • Sep 15, 2008
I was a Leica R4 film shooter, until moving over to Canon's 20D and my current Canon 1DsMkIII and L lens system. I appreciate learning about Zeiss from all of you. A thread like this is what makes DPRev. so useful -- at times.
best wishes to all,
--
Photoshrink, Ph.D.

'If I am not for myself, who will be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? And if
not now, when?'
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Waldo Nell • Contributing Member • Posts: 974
No offense to anyone, but...
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
none of these posts really seems objective and accurate. I am also interested to know (on a lens by lens basis obviously as one cannot generalize) whether the Zeiss is better than the best corresponding Canon lenses, and if yes, by how much?

But I'd like to see some formal testing or examples which can be directly compared. Yes I know it is difficult due to system differences, but is there anywhere one can find a reasonable comparison?
--
Waldo Nell
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
nsoler • Regular Member • Posts: 184
Re: Zeiss has been around for a long time
In reply to Lundy • Sep 15, 2008
Wow that was a great read. Fantastic history, the fact that Cosina pretty much makes all of Carl Zeiss lenses. I wonder why Cosina just do it themselves? I mean it wouldn't be the exact same lens formula but perhaps something that has EF electronics built in. Or does Cosina make lenses for Sigma, Tokina and or Tamron??? Hmmm I'll wiki search.

+--------------------------------------------------------+
Current Gear: Canon (film/digital), Leica M (film), Bronica SQ-Ai
Reply    Reply with quote    Complain
Volker Hett • Senior Member • Posts: 1,214
Yes (nt)
In reply to JackM • Sep 15, 2008
-- hide signature --
I wanted a better viewfinder and now I need more money
Reply    Reply with quote 


https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2417350

The most accurate mechanical timepiece ever crafted

The most accurate mechanical timepiece ever crafted


Mike HanlonApril 17th, 2005

April 17, 2005 TAG Heuer released another first at the Baselworld 2005 global watch mecca - the most accurate mechanical timepiece ever crafted, the “Calibre 360” Concept Chronograph. The “Calibre 360” Concept Chronograph is the first mechanical wrist chronograph to measure and display time to 1/100th of a second, thanks to the exceptionally high frequency of its balance wheel, which oscillates at 360,000 beats per hour, 10 times faster than any other chronograph—a rate that until now was considered impossible.

The ultra resistant and light titanium Ti5 "Calibre 360" Concept Chronograph is the flagship of the range and is being marketed in association with McLaren Mercedes F1 driver Juan Pablo Montoya and is designed to highlight TAG Heuer's superior innovation and commanding lead over the rest of the Swiss watchmaking industry, as underlined in 2004 by the consulting firm A.T. Kearney and the business magazine Bilanz, which identified TAG Heuer as one of the three most innovative companies in Switzerland and one of the leading innovators in Europe.

Formula 1 driver and watch collector Juan Pablo Montoya had input in the design of this car racing-inspired Concept Chronograph.

TAG Heuer's history has been more than just radical. Starting with its first stopwatch patent in 1869, followed by the revolutionary oscillating pinion of 1887 — still an essential component in today's mechanical chronographs like the TAG Heuer Calibre 16 — the Company has relentlessly pushed Swiss watchmaking tradition forward by challenging and innovating on its most time-honored conventions.

In1916, with the invention of the Micrograph — the first pocket timepiece accurate to 1/100th of a second — TAG Heuer took the first step towards this year's revolutionary “Calibre 360” Concept Chronograph.

It quickly became the timepiece of choice at top-level sports events, solidifying TAG Heuer's reputation as the world's best timekeeper. Having earned renown for the mechanical perfection of its products, the company continued its quest for accuracy and innovation in the service of both sports and science. In 1969, TAG Heuer revolutionized chronographs at Basel by being the first to market an automatic chronograph movement, the famous Calibre 11 (Chronomatic) with a microrotor to rewind the barrels.

First the Micrograph, then the 1969 Chronomatic Calibre 11, and now the TAG Heuer “Calibre 360” Concept Chronograph. The world's most accurate wrist chronograph, the revolutionary new “Calibre 360” Concept Chronograph directly incorporates technology and techniques drawn from both of these prior innovations.

The “Calibre 360” Concept Chronograph represents the culmination of TAG Heuer’s know-how and expertise in the field of precision mechanical watchmaking and sports timekeeping. Finally, after years of painstaking research and experimentation, every mechanical obstacle has been eliminated through a groundbreaking manufacturing concept and a world first in horology: The first 1/100th of a second wrist mechanical chronograph To achieve this exceptional level of precision, TAG Heuer has developed a unique and complex movement, the principle of which was set by the Chronomatic Calibre 11 in 1969. Made of more than 234 components and modules which 131 are directly from the chronograph movement, it actually fuses two distinctive mechanical movements, each connected to the other but operating independently.

To ensure precision adjustment and independent operation, the basis of the “Calibre 360” Concept Chronograph is an automatic movement, the TAG Heuer Calibre 7, with a power-reserve of 42 hours and a heart beating at 28,800 vibrations per hour. Highly resistant to wrist shock and wear effects, embellished with Côtes de Genève decoration on the oscillating mass, this movement has been certified as a chronometer by the COSC (the Swiss Official Chronometer Control institute).

What is most extraordinary about the “Calibre 360” movement is that the chronograph function is not just a "module" added on to the automatic watch movement.

With its barrel, separate manual winding system, gearwheel and the independent balance wheel and spiral mechanism, it is a genuine and wholly separate movement, a chronograph with a power-reserve counter and a quick-rotating barrel that offers 100 minutes of power reserve, plus its most remarkable component: a single-pallet escapement wheel and special balance wheel. The high-precision mechanism, specially created and hand-assembled, provides an unbelievable oscillating frequency of 360,000 vibrations per hour. With such a high-powered system, the “Calibre 360” creates a new milestone in Swiss watchmaking history. The quantum leap to 360,000 vibrations per hour from usually 28,800 or 36,000 could be compared to a Formula 1 engine jumping from 18,000 rpm to 180,000 rpm !

As the “Calibre 360” is a worldwide first in the history of watchmaking, TAG Heuer has filed for two exclusive worldwide patents :

The first patent protects the 1/100th of a second counter on a mechanical wrist chronograph.

The second patent protects the unique crown control system. The single crown winds both movements and controls the watch’s hour and date settings. A clockwise rotation loads the barrel on the manual chronograph movement; a counter-clockwise rotation rewinds the automatic movement that gives the time.

As usual, TAG Heuer's designers, stimulated by the input of watch collector and star Formula 1 driver, Juan Pablo Montoya, have created an exceptionally daring timepiece to house the “Calibre 360” movement. This masterpiece is easily recognizable thanks to its unique and exceptional architecture: like a pure high-tech engine, the chronograph functions are displayed through the wrought Côtes-de-Genève “chronograph engine”, which contrasts with the flat-black dial.

At 6 o'clock, an oversized circular fine-brushed counter keeps track of the 1/100ths-of-a-second red hand, while at 9 o'clock, a red minute needle directly integrated into the “chronograph engine” displays the elapsed time on a 9 minutes scale disk, particularly adapted for the car-race timekeeping. At 12 o'clock, the wearer can see the power-reserve indicator of 100 minutes, displayed in the same way as the fuel indicator of car’s dashboards, through the “chronograph engine's” angled polished opening. The result is a look as radicallyinspired by car racing as the high-tech technology housed inside it.

Designed to accentuate the Calibre 360’s exceptional movement, the case has been crafted from titanium Grade 5, an exclusive TAG Heuer material developed with McLaren in 1997 for the Kirium series, and combining utmost resistance with utmost lightness as well as sparkling polish effect. It’s a pure TAG Heuer case with oversized crown and asymmetrical pushbuttons, the larger of which, at two o’clock and capped bright red, controls the stopwatch.

Once pressed, the chronograph mechanism springs into action, simultaneously activating the chronograph second hand in the centre of the dial and the 100ths-of-a-second hand located in a counter at six o’clock. Thanks to the high oscillating frequency, the centre hand advances at a perfectly regular pace, and the 100ths counter makes a complete rotation in one second. This invention is not only an aesthetic success; it also lets the user explore just how long a second can last and discover how pleasant it is to watch time pass in a “smooth-as-silk” fashion.

On the caseback, two semicircle windows in sapphire give another perspective on this extraordinary movement, a new classic masterpiece, uniquely designed and manufactured by TAG Heuer.

Developed with Juan Pablo Montoya, the bracelet is, naturally, in stylish black rubber with folding buckle, further enhancing comfort and ergonomy, even when driving at 300 km/h and crossing the finish line with a few 100ths-of-a-second lead.

https://newatlas.com/go/3948/

swiss movement is better than japanese movement

What Are The Best Watch Movements?

 
Zen L. from Shanghai, China asks:
I have become pretty knowledgeable about watches in a relatively short time thanks in no small part to your wonderful site. But movements are still largely over my head. I understand that such technical knowledge comes with experience over time, but I would like more guidance. For example, I would like to be able to compare side by side many watches using the same ETA (or other) movement, but I have not yet found an internet source that quite achieves this. Prices often vary substantially between watches with the same machinery inside. So what characteristics make certain movements particularly good? And why specifically are Japanese (and others) so much cheaper? So I know there are many variables, but I am trying to phrase this in the form of a question, like on Jeopardy... As a relative novice, what should I look at in a watch's movement?
There is no straight-forward answer to this because for one thing the answer depends on what you value in a watch movement. Some people want the most accurate movements, some people want the most complicated. Others want the most beautifully decorated movements, while others want those that will work and work for years to come. Few movements are able to incorporate all of these things.
Having said that there are a few things that we can state. Also, we aren't watch makers so we can't go ultra in-depth comparing machine to machine as that level of insight isn't our forte. Swiss ETA movements produced by the Swatch Group are mostly excellent. From a sheer quality perspective these are hard to match. They may be common, they may not all be complicated, but they are durable and mostly very reliable. ETA produces a huge volume of movements each year, and has had decades to work out small issues in them in order to make some of the best mass-produced mechanical movements around. All things equal, they are fantastic.
To a large degree, those same qualities apply to Rolex movements, which are known to be accurate, dependable, and easily serviced. Something that is very important to know is that mass produced movements that do the same thing (say, three hand with date) but made from different companies are going to be technically very similar. In a way, it is like a car engine. If three movements are designs with the same functions and require the same level of performance - assuming they each use the same technology, how different are they actually going to be? In reality, not very different at all.
Then you have lower production and exotic watches. As a rule, the lower the production, the more expensive the movements are going to be. That is because the producer cannot earn revenue with volume and must recoup their investment on a limited number of produced items. There is also less incentive for low-production watches to be properly engineered or tested. The watch industry is full of horror stories of highly exotic watch movements not working from day 1 - and then the manufacturer asking for the clients to pay for the repair of defective movements. This is not the norm, but it happens a lot.
So going back to our original thoughts, The more simple and higher production movements that have been produced for the longest are the best. Even the same movements are available in many grades. The famous Swiss ETA Valjoux 7750 movement comes in many grades that increase in price for better parts and decoration.
Japanese movements are cheaper because of their production philosophy. For the most part, if you compare a mass produced ETA with a Miyota the ETA will have a higher level of performance and more attractive parts. But, of course, be much more expensive. Japanese movements are produced much more efficiently, and some of them actually come very close to Swiss performance, even if they don't look as pretty. Japanese movements are often produced outside of Japan where labor is cheaper, while the "Swiss Made" designation requires a more Swiss labor, and the price thereof. Those are some of the reasons that Japanese movements tend to be cheaper.
As you can see, a comparison of movements would be complex, and require a serious level of watchmaking and engineering that few people have. People who buy mechanical watches accept that they aren't as accurate as quartz movements, are more beautiful, and as machines will need to be serviced from time to time. If you are worried about quality and performance, go with brands that use high-grade movements from ETA, or have produced their own movements in-house for a long time offering them the ability to perfect the manufacturing process and work out any kinks in their movements.

https://www.ablogtowatch.com/ask-watch-experts/what-are-the-best-watch-movements/

meter rule is more accurate than vernier caliper and vernier caliper is more precise than meter rule